Journalistic ire over the decades has been lavished on non governmental organizations at the rate of heaps per minute. There was a period where the detractors and the guilty organizations undermined any good emerging from the sector. One of the lines crossed in critique lumped all non governmental outfits (regardless of functions and outcomes) under the generic label of NGOs. Not surprisingly the press has rarely been interested in NGO functioning per se. In this scenario the perspective of Shirkat Gah’s Najma Sadeque becomes significant when her 25 year association with journalism is kept in view. As a journalist she has had deep associations with both the Dawn Group of Newspapers and The News. In 1975 Najma Sadeque became a founding member of Shirkat Gah which to this day has one the most integrated approaches to economics, environment and women’s awareness that can be witnessed in the development sector. In this interview, Najma Sadeque holds forth on the relationship between the press and NGOs and the contemporary space for social activism.
M: There is a school of thought that associates the rise of NGOs with the spread of neo-liberalism in countries such as Pakistan. Do you believe they operate to support the same institutions?
NS: No, not deliberately so. I believe NGOs have existed and worked successfully in Pakistan much before the neoliberalism entered our borders. However IFIs have increasingly begun to influence the work of NGOs, especially small NGOs by incorporating them through funding and consultative bodies. It is a dangerous path to go down and there are many organizations like Shirkat Gah who do not take funding from the U.S.A or institutions such as the World Bank.
M: At the same time however, mainstream media particularly Urdu media reports NGOs in a critical light where they are touted as ‘agents of the West’.
NS: Mainstream reports tend to highlight only one thing about NGOs-that they have conferences in ‘big’ hotels and hence waste money. The same critique is never leveled at government functionaries when they spend taxpayers’ money to hold lavish conferences in five-star hotel. I wish NGOs were able to hold events in smaller places, unfortunately there are no community centers that would support a gathering of at least 200 people. For a time Karachi had SIDCO community centre but it no longer exists. Practically the constraint is also the fact that government functionaries tend not to show up at events conducted at smaller places. Unfortunately we need to get the ear of a government official if any of our studies or practices can be hoped to have a sustainable effect.
M: Are there any trends in the lens a journalist casts on NGO workers?
NS: Interestingly, a number of journalists have a strong bias against women’s NGO. The rhetoric is the greatest against them and the funding tends to be the least. Women’s empowerment is the kind of empowerment that people shy from. Recently one of our donors agreed to fund a venture in women’s agriculture but backed out when they found it would make the target group of women self-reliant. The attitude just goes to reinforce the stereotypes of ‘male mentality’ in Pakistan.
M: Generally the perception is that unless you go into the village you’re not helping anyone. Annoyingly it is assumed that NGOs have to carry the burden of the ‘native villager’ and hence it is an agency of great deliverance.
NS: I remember once a journalist asking me as a mark of my credibility if I had ever been in a village. It did not matter that he had not been, nor did he have any idea as to how one goes about it or what the social structure of a village tends to be. It is ignorant talk, limited to urbanites and in 25 years it has not changed at all. They assume that we can just walk into a village. It is unheard of. There are systems of consent without which it is unethical of NGOs to work in any area. Research alone needs permission particularly in rural areas. 15 years ago we volunteered to teach functional literacy and health awareness to women in a community center in Baldia. Mind you this is an urban area and the community had Shirkat Gah thoroughly investigated before they allowed us to step in. They visited our offices and interviewed our personnel which is their right.
M: Urbanite attitudes towards development work are curiously mixed. While there is much emphasis on how something should be done, there are few instances of activism, why do you think that happens?
NS: Karachi has a plethora of problems, and a number of agencies highlighting each problem. The standard reaction of a middle class citizen is to get confused and withdraw. It seems like a range of competing interests with each NGO drawing attention to its own cause and the education systems plying the country have left citizens unable to integrate the problems of the country in one context. It doesn’t help that education systems have tailored people to think that techniques such as HYV (in seeds) are actually good because its new technology. Green economics or environment as a result becomes very difficult to explain to people because they have no general environmental understanding. The concept of commons and public goods are both absent here.
M: How does that affect collectivization?
NS: Because people fail to see the need to collectivize. To them an investor who buys a national enterprise under “privatization” is bringing in a magical service. They fail to see that at the end of the day they have gained little because while there is no transfer of technology, there is complete transfer of ownership and profits are thus repatriated abroad to the company’s home country. I am in favor of private enterprise but not when it means selling entire assets.
M: Experience shows that none of the problems addressed by NGOs can be compartmentalized if any true change is to be achieved. Then why the cut-and-dried approach of these agencies?
NS: Logistically, financially and in terms of personnel, Karachi has too many issues to be handled under one blanket organization. Resources are very limited in this sector so it is more productive to go into one area and do the best that you can. Compartmentalization becomes a problem where NGOs fail to put their focus issue in a context. They provide no general background to the issue that shows how it is linked to other problems of Karachi and worse still there is no sharing of practices across NGOs.
M: Are there any moves to integrate NGOs so as to avoid a reductionist approach to every social problem?
NS: There have been some positive instances in the last few years. One of the is the JAF i.e. the Joint Action Forum based in Karachi, Lahore and Islambad. The Forum comprises 25-30 NGOs that meet regularly on issues that affect us all. The purpose is to achieve a united front on common issues. At present the Forum reacts to an issue as it comes up. It is a process we need but we also need to move beyond it towards a shared understanding of our country’s background and history.
M: NGOs have started slipping from advocacy functions to service delivery functions all the while proclaiming to be ‘apolitical’. How much of that do you think is to do with donor agendas?
NS: I don’t think they are apolitical at all. Under that label, by default, they support whatever the government it doing thus enabling the government to shirk its duty. Such an approach won’t work because NGOs can never achieve the outreach all over the country that the government can. However, money for advocacy issues is extremely hard to come by. There is a lot of money in the country but even local philanthropists want to fund ‘safe’ projects like schools or hospitals. And they definitely do not want to get into anything controversial.
In the conversation on the dynamics of the narrow definition of civil society in Pakistan Ms. Sadeque is emphatic about the need for individual activism. “At the end of the day, it is just the difference between acting and not acting. Over the time it does make a difference because if you look at history, people who don’t act inevitably lose out because they make it easier to be oppressed. There are success stories but obviously they will never be highlighted as much as the failures.”
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